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Post Reply Where's the beef?
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30 / M / Chicago, USA
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Posted 5/20/17 , edited 5/22/17
I like reading reviews after I watch a show. I like to see what others thought of what I just saw. Most agree but once in a while I see strange new perspectives and I get to experience the show again with a new angle on it. It can be fun.

This is why I find it very strange when I see someone knocking down a show [in the Reviews] just for being Ecchi. I don't see Ecchi fans doing that to Slice of Life or Mystery shows [in Reviews]. So the attacks seem to be one-sided and mean spirited. I have even seen accusations against Crunchyroll for pandering to the lowest denominator humans. I think that went too far, but I was told to take it and sit down, I'm a good boy so I did. Weird thing to accuse a site with highest count of censorship of pandering "smut"... but hey, to each their own.

In the reviews I also noticed Ecchi abolitionists seem to say there's too much harem, or too much FS, or just Ecchi in general is too much. I have missed something. Ecchi tab has maybe 50 shows of which 20 are censored and 30 are PG13. And that includes rom-coms like Astratte's Toy (or something).

Since when is an animated boob the most horrible thing you can see on TV (or the equivalency of a TV)? I like raunchy humor and awkward situations (situational humor), so I like a lot of ecchi comedies, and even some harem anime. If it was live action, I could see the "vulgarity" argument having merit, but I can't see it applying to anime. In fact I think most of it works especially because it is animated. I also like seinen anime, and see a lot of those being attacked as well.

I see many shows not appearing in the lineups for the past few seasons, some of those are good shows. It has led me to get a feeling Crunchy is willfully passing up good shows just to avoid a backlash or is just responding to the negative reviews. I'm not going to say I know this to be a fact, but the scarcity of such shows in the season lineups and the sub-par quality of the lineups compared to previous seasons have led me to those two assumptions. With limited budget I don't expect any company to be able to deliver all anime, but having to visit other sites more and more often to find the kind of shows I like, leaves a poor taste in my mouth. Seeing more children's anime appear while teen+ anime disappear is discouraging.

So here's my question, where's the beef with Ecchi and Seiner anime? Why is it despised by so many?
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49 / M / New England, USA
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Posted 5/20/17 , edited 5/21/17

dhristo1 wrote:

So here's my question, where's the beef with Ecchi and Seiner anime? Why is it despised by so many?


I think, unfortunately, there's no true answer to your question as differences of likes, appearances, cultures, etc all bring different factors to the table. Some such people ...

1) Prudes who think all "cartoons" should be "family-fare".
2) Those who think they're "too smart" for Ecchi.
3) Those with puritanical religious beliefs.
4) Hardcore feminists.
5) Children who are sneaking a watch and not quite understanding what's going on.
6) Those just wanting to "look cool" to their friends.
7) Those who dislike comedy, fan-service or both.
8) Those who find most Ecchi "too trope" in general.
9) Men and women who are just uncomfortable with sex on tv/in movies in general.
10) Parents who are afraid their kids could accidentally run into the shows.

Those are just some or the people I've met over the years who have asked me to explain why I like Ecchi and what I see in it. They don't always quite accept the answer I give them but it's my answer and the one I stick by; "I like what I like and you like what you like, it's just the way it is". I don't plan on stopping watching anytime in the near or distant future.
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24 / F / United States, DE
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Posted 5/20/17
I agree with some of neugenx 's points. A lot of people are ecchi snobs.

But hey if you don't like it, that's fine. Don't watch it. I only have a problem with those people when they try to talk others down for liking it themselves.
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30 / M / Chicago, USA
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Posted 5/21/17
See, I wanted to avoid jumping to such conclusions. Just out of integrity? Maybe self aggrandizement? But also, I wanted to keep an open mind about the people I share an interest with; anime. But the lack of responses from the detractors is telling. One, my thread was possibly reported at worst or ignored at best. It seems there is no common ground. That is saddening.

Saddening because that may lead Crunchy to the same position as Funi, where their libraries of FS/Ecchi/Harem shrunk to 1/4 of their sizes. It looks like the second one of my hobbies becomes "mainstream" it gets neutered and tamed. 2015 gaming was attacked and had to defend that, now it feels anime is being assaulted, I guess I better stock up on superchargers and engine blocks before those become some sort of taboo. Oh, wait...

Or I could be hypersensitive and overreacting, or just vanilla paranoid? Anyway, we still have Freezing and High School DxD... though Chobits really strums the heart strings IMO.
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25 / F / PA, USA
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Posted 5/21/17
I'm going to go with; you are hypersensitive and over-reacting, and "vanilla-paranoid."

You've geared your thread in such a way that there isn't much room for civil discussion. Right off the bat, you put those who're not echo fans on the defensive, by throwing around "I don't see ____ doing it," and even saying that it's one-sided. He'll, you've proven that it most certainly isn't one-sided, simply with your own OP and most especially with your first response. If your first move is to assert that one point of view is the sole aggressor, and the other blameless victims, you're setting up fighting and echo-chambers. Most importantly, your offense at not inspiring the amount of thread traffic you wish for (going on to moan about there being "no hope"), warrents a flick to your forehead, to say the least. Your thread is one day old, has a virtroil atmosphere, and isn't exactly the most titillating of topics; don't expect the world.
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21 / F
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Posted 5/21/17

dhristo1 wrote:

I see many shows not appearing in the lineups for the past few seasons, some of those are good shows. It has led me to get a feeling Crunchy is willfully passing up good shows just to avoid a backlash or is just responding to the negative reviews. I'm not going to say I know this to be a fact, but the scarcity of such shows in the season lineups and the sub-par quality of the lineups compared to previous seasons have led me to those two assumptions. With limited budget I don't expect any company to be able to deliver all anime, but having to visit other sites more and more often to find the kind of shows I like, leaves a poor taste in my mouth. Seeing more children's anime appear while teen+ anime disappear is discouraging.

So here's my question, where's the beef with Ecchi and Seiner anime? Why is it despised by so many?


First, qualify "good shows". But since this site licenses Prisma Illya I highly doubt they're avoiding Ecchi for ethical reasons. The simplest and most likely reason is probably the one you don't want to hear: Ecchi shows on CR aren't selling well enough to buy them up. Ecchi might sell well on TV in Japan, but if CR itself doesn't find its audience watching a lot of it, then it's not going to buy the license to it.

Ecchi is objectifying. There's some leeway with it being animated, but that's not enough for a good amount of people. That's why a good handful of people don't like it. Many find it tasteless and/or banal. I'm not saying this to be combative or aggressive so I apologize if it comes off that way, but you asked a pretty silly question. Some find Ecchi to be too much, and may prefer that kind of humor either in small amounts in other shows or simply not at all.

That or they don't see the point when they can just watch hentai. Honestly that's probably the most common answer.
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24 / M
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Posted 5/21/17
Sometimes "ecchi" content does get in the way of a show, while I don't think the opposite is often the case (although I suppose it is technically possible). In a lot of shows, it is easy to understand complaints about it getting in the way. In many other ecchi focused shows, often the shows sacrifice a lot to center themselves on the ecchi content.

I think it is pretty rare for ecchi shows to be traditionally good. That doesn't mean it shouldn't exist, but just that I can understand most of the complaints about boobs over substance.
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34 / Pacific North West
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Posted 5/21/17 , edited 5/21/17
I would like to start by saying I have no issues with Ecchi/harem shows as long as they are well done. My personal "beef" is that it seems like Authors just don't understand how Ecchi/fanservice works anymore. Ecchi should IMO add situational humor to a scene that would otherwise be rather dry or dragging on, shock value if you will. The same is true with fan service as well. Lots of anime have the "beach" scene, which is a kind of a catch all chance to use fan service.

You mentioned Chobits which I think is a great example how Ecchi can be amusing when used correctly. My issue is shows like Akashic records. The show from what I have seen isn't Ecchi in the classic sense, and the "fan service" is so blatant(girl uniforms) i feel like it detracts from the show. Now if Akashic was indeed an Ecchi/hentai show the outfits would be fitting. However IMO the outfits make no sense for that show in particular and almost ruins the shows inherent storyline. Also you mentioned FREEZING which I am not sure why it qualifies as Ecchi. As the sexual playfulness was almost non existent, it was just breast shots every 45seconds which IMO makes it more of a Hentai but that's my opinion
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25 / F / Philippines
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Posted 5/21/17 , edited 5/21/17
Pointed out by three other people above are some of my issues with it as well.

To me, ecchi/fanservice isn't that bad if kept at a minimum and not ruining the show. By ruining, I mean the shows plot isn't focused anymore because they decided the boob-grabs, swimsuit episodes and perverted misunderstanding are more important. Also, when there's too much ecchi, I find the show almost unwatchable due to seeing panty shots and jiggling boobs every few seconds. Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with some ecchi. No Game No Life had a lot of fanservice and stuff but they didn't get in the way of the story and most happen while the story is going on which mean it didn't take over the shows story so I'm fine with it. Also, many old shows I've seen from my childhood have fanservice but they didn't get in the way of the show and done well enough that my parents didn't have an issue with me and my siblings watching it. Today, it's just so blatant and they're pushing it to the limit of what's acceptable that we find it hard to even watch the show in the same room as our parents.

As for harem, there might be some good harem anime out there but most suffers from the ecchi problem above. I mean I've seen a ton of shows which promised a good plot with action, romance, and such but when the show airs, only a few episodes are focused on the story advertised and the rest are focused on how the girls will seduce the MC or hit him again when a perverted misunderstanding occurs.

This is all just my opinion though.
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28 / F / The margins
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Posted 5/21/17
I'll say something here within the next few days; I do think you're looking at this from too narrow a perspective.
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25 / M / within the world...
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Posted 5/21/17
I looove me some echii when it's part of the plot
but at the same tiiime...that seven deadly sin show or w/e I just end up laughing like a kid at because of how in your face it is.
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27 / F / Outer Orbit
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Posted 5/21/17 , edited 5/21/17
It's all sexist and full of muh-sogeeny and made for rapists and male gaze and for white male straight viewers and I don't like it so noone can be allowed to like it I men oh my god like really, you cis white pig. This must be censored and changed right NOOOW. And don't you even try mansplain your way out of it!

...Or some such. Don't you know, the SJWs are moving into anime nowdays. Well, started in 2016, noticeably. So it's that and then also some random people who do not adhere to insanity, but just formulate their opinions rather oddly, so instead of saying "I don't like it." they say "You shouldn't like it." which makes it all feel a bit wrong. At the end of the day tho, I don't think we need to worry too much, the Japanese manga & anime & games showed rather commendable resistance to the western regressive crap crowd so hey, let us just keep enjoying out panties and bosoms while laughing at the screaming harpy.
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Hoosierville
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Posted 5/21/17 , edited 5/22/17
9496 cr points
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30 / M / Chicago, USA
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Posted 5/22/17

Cardamom_Ginger wrote:

I'm going to go with; you are hypersensitive and over-reacting, and "vanilla-paranoid."

You've geared your thread in such a way that there isn't much room for civil discussion. Right off the bat, you put those who're not echo fans on the defensive, by throwing around "I don't see ____ doing it," and even saying that it's one-sided. He'll, you've proven that it most certainly isn't one-sided, simply with your own OP and most especially with your first response. If your first move is to assert that one point of view is the sole aggressor, and the other blameless victims, you're setting up fighting and echo-chambers. Most importantly, your offense at not inspiring the amount of thread traffic you wish for (going on to moan about there being "no hope"), warrents a flick to your forehead, to say the least. Your thread is one day old, has a virtroil atmosphere, and isn't exactly the most titillating of topics; don't expect the world.


Did you even finish reading the sentence? I specify exactly what I don't see one group doing. Asking a question in an open forum is hardly an "echo chamber". You thought it's titillating enough to respond after reading (poorly) both my posts. You do realize this post doesn't affect any show's ratings. I never complained about the traffic, there's such statistic as "viewed" and then you do simple statistical analysis, simple. I do appreciate your response though, truly, I will work on tone and wording to be more sensitive in the future.
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