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Post Reply What is the point of time traveling?
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47 / M / Auburn, Washington
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Posted 6/12/17

Ryulightorb wrote:

1. i'm not making shit up there is nothing to say it will stay small either


Try biology 101.

https://services.math.duke.edu/education/ccp/materials/diffeq/logistic/logi1.html

Populations in an environment where resources are scarce naturally decrease their growth rate. Since the 1960s, we've been increasingly aware of resource limitations, and population growth has slowed accordingly.

See, that's science. The scientific community primarily believe the population growth will not only stay small, but continue to decrease until roughly the middle of the 22nd century - when the world population should stabilise at about twelve billion.

So where's the material backing your hypothesis that you totally did not just make up?


plus if we want to advance faster we need more people


Stop making shit up.

We are already advancing faster than we have ever advanced, and there is no sign that we will slow down or stop anytime soon. There is no evidence that "space-faring" is good for ANYTHING, because we have never fucking done it and neither has anyone else. There are no known materials anywhere in space that we can't make here on Earth. And every useful tool we ever got from NASA was made by a subcontractor right here on Earth, with Earth materials and Earth processes.

Sending people into space has just plain never returned anything meaningful that we couldn't have gotten without it.
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Posted 6/12/17 , edited 6/12/17

cdarklock wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:

1. i'm not making shit up there is nothing to say it will stay small either


Try biology 101.

https://services.math.duke.edu/education/ccp/materials/diffeq/logistic/logi1.html

Populations in an environment where resources are scarce naturally decrease their growth rate. Since the 1960s, we've been increasingly aware of resource limitations, and population growth has slowed accordingly.

See, that's science. The scientific community primarily believe the population growth will not only stay small, but continue to decrease until roughly the middle of the 22nd century - when the world population should stabilise at about twelve billion.

So where's the material backing your hypothesis that you totally did not just make up?


plus if we want to advance faster we need more people


Stop making shit up.

We are already advancing faster than we have ever advanced, and there is no sign that we will slow down or stop anytime soon. There is no evidence that "space-faring" is good for ANYTHING, because we have never fucking done it and neither has anyone else. There are no known materials anywhere in space that we can't make here on Earth. And every useful tool we ever got from NASA was made by a subcontractor right here on Earth, with Earth materials and Earth processes.

Sending people into space has just plain never returned anything meaningful that we couldn't have gotten without it.



1. sigh you just don't get it yes it will decrease but there is always a chance it will rise denying that is being stupid.

2. i'm not making up shit of course we are advancing but space travel will help speed that up.
Space-fairing has improved my life with the creations that have come from NASA also of course it's been made with earth materials and proccesses we haven't settled other planets.
Yes there are no known materials but we will never no otherwise if we don't explore.

I personally want to have us explore space and maybe even visit another planet if it ever becomes possible.

It's about what may happen if that can't convince you then you probably won't change your mind but i think space travel is a necessity especially for my wants for the future.

Humans spreading through the cosmos would be the best thing to happen ever imo.

Also sending people to space has given us data we can use for future space travel how would you have gotten that data on the efficiency of space ships and development of them without space travel?
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Posted 6/12/17

fredreload wrote:

I need someone to convince me that time traveling is worth it.

Past:
So you time travel back to the past, but when you change something in the past, you create a new time line. If you are going back to fix something, there is always an original time line where things didn't work out because of infinite time lines. And of course, fixing every possible mistakes to achieve the best route for yourself seems a bit pointless since you are only branching off to the world line of your choice.

Future:
You arrive at the maximum possible future, you gain all technology ever existed, you become a supreme being that all could achieve once a time machine is built. Sure but there must be something more to it?


So I am wondering if there is a point to time travel


It's okay. It's extremely unlikely that you'd even be able to do something like that so why even think about whether it's "worth it" or not.
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Posted 6/12/17

Ryulightorb wrote:

1. sigh you just don't get it


No, I totally get it.

"But spaaaaaaaaaaace"

Just like everyone else who thinks space travel is a good idea. No good reason. Just, you know, you LIKE the idea. So it must be a good one. Meanwhile, here is a bunch of shit you made up.


yes it will decrease but there is always a chance it will rise denying that is being stupid.


I'm only denying that the chance is large enough to justify anything. Sure, the chance is not zero. But I'm going to bet on science and reason, not speculation and bullshit. Science says it's going to keep going down, reason says it's going to keep going down, "BUT MAYBE IT WON'T" says someone with no relevant education or credentials... I'm gonna keep my chips where they are.


2. i'm not making up shit


Yes, you are. See, look:


of course we are advancing but space travel will help speed that up.


How do you know this?

The overwhelming majority of scientific and engineering advancement has not one damn thing to do with space travel. The number of inventions and advancements that have something to do with space are statistically near zero.

So you are predicting the future with literally no historical evidence that your prediction has merit. In fact, what you are predicting is contraindicated by the historical record. Every rational indicator points in the opposite direction. You are pointing to something that does not exist, which we have no reason to believe will exist, because you want to point there.

That's called MAKING SHIT UP.

There's nothing wrong with making shit up. Make up all the shit you want. But recognise that you have just made it up, and it does not constitute any sort of valid reasoning.

I can easily speculate that by investing twenty billion in space and only seven in disease, we will ultimately fuck up somewhere and end up with a global pandemic that wipes out the species because we were too busy looking at space. But that is not reality. That is just shit I made up, and it is not a reason for anything. It is an unqualified fear that has no rational foundation. Is it more likely than rampant overpopulation? Yes! But the chance is still damn close to nothing, and there's no reason to worry about it.

For God's sake, a zombie apocalypse is more likely than global overpopulation, and you'd have to be a fucking idiot to seriously prep for that.


Also sending people to space has given us data we can use for future space travel


"Stuffing jalapenos up my arse has taught me a lot about the best way to stuff jalapenos up my arse"

That's not a good reason.
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Posted 6/12/17

cdarklock wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:

1. sigh you just don't get it


No, I totally get it.

"But spaaaaaaaaaaace"

Just like everyone else who thinks space travel is a good idea. No good reason. Just, you know, you LIKE the idea. So it must be a good one. Meanwhile, here is a bunch of shit you made up.


yes it will decrease but there is always a chance it will rise denying that is being stupid.


I'm only denying that the chance is large enough to justify anything. Sure, the chance is not zero. But I'm going to bet on science and reason, not speculation and bullshit. Science says it's going to keep going down, reason says it's going to keep going down, "BUT MAYBE IT WON'T" says someone with no relevant education or credentials... I'm gonna keep my chips where they are.


2. i'm not making up shit


Yes, you are. See, look:


of course we are advancing but space travel will help speed that up.


How do you know this?

The overwhelming majority of scientific and engineering advancement has not one damn thing to do with space travel. The number of inventions and advancements that have something to do with space are statistically near zero.

So you are predicting the future with literally no historical evidence that your prediction has merit. In fact, what you are predicting is contraindicated by the historical record. Every rational indicator points in the opposite direction. You are pointing to something that does not exist, which we have no reason to believe will exist, because you want to point there.

That's called MAKING SHIT UP.

There's nothing wrong with making shit up. Make up all the shit you want. But recognise that you have just made it up, and it does not constitute any sort of valid reasoning.

I can easily speculate that by investing twenty billion in space and only seven in disease, we will ultimately fuck up somewhere and end up with a global pandemic that wipes out the species because we were too busy looking at space. But that is not reality. That is just shit I made up, and it is not a reason for anything. It is an unqualified fear that has no rational foundation. Is it more likely than rampant overpopulation? Yes! But the chance is still damn close to nothing, and there's no reason to worry about it.

For God's sake, a zombie apocalypse is more likely than global overpopulation, and you'd have to be a fucking idiot to seriously prep for that.


Also sending people to space has given us data we can use for future space travel


"Stuffing jalapenos up my arse has taught me a lot about the best way to stuff jalapenos up my arse"

That's not a good reason.



1. Not just but space the benefits are high atleast to me.

2. The chance is enough to justify it imo you are welcome to your opinion

3. no i'm not

4. Not making shit up it's obvious and logical if we spread across the galaxy it would mean more people per planet and we would birth more people as there are more people there are more people to research and work which leads to advancement.

I'm not making shit up you just refuse to see obvious things.
That is a prediction but one that follows core concepts we have seen in history as civlizations grow so does the speed of advancement whether it be because of machines or new ways to advance or the sheer amount of people.

5. except stuffing jalapenos leads no where good...seriously your arguments are weak for being against space travel.

we obviously won't see eye to eye but i think it's a very worthy cause for funding.
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Posted 6/12/17

nanikore2 wrote:


fredreload wrote:

I need someone to convince me that time traveling is worth it.

Past:
So you time travel back to the past, but when you change something in the past, you create a new time line. If you are going back to fix something, there is always an original time line where things didn't work out because of infinite time lines. And of course, fixing every possible mistakes to achieve the best route for yourself seems a bit pointless since you are only branching off to the world line of your choice.

Future:
You arrive at the maximum possible future, you gain all technology ever existed, you become a supreme being that all could achieve once a time machine is built. Sure but there must be something more to it?


So I am wondering if there is a point to time travel


It's okay. It's extremely unlikely that you'd even be able to do something like that so why even think about whether it's "worth it" or not.


It's fun to think about so why not?
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Posted 6/12/17

Ryulightorb wrote:
Not just but space the benefits are high atleast to me.


Absolutely nothing you materially benefit from has actually been to space. It was invented here and manufactured here and space travel has not one damn thing to do with it.

And all the things you think you get from space travel are not real. They are just a bullshit fantasy in your head.

When we spread out across the galaxy and colonise other planets, for example, we have absolutely no idea what will happen because first we need to address a massive series of huge problems that have no current solutions, and may never have solutions. If just one of those problems never gets a solution, we can't do it.

So spreading out and colonising planets is not reality. It is not a thing that we can do now, and it may never be a thing we can do. You can't say what it would mean, because we don't know. Nobody knows. And that is about as far from "obvious and logical" as you can get.

All of your wild speculations about how awesome it would be are just shit you made up after seeing a bunch of movies and television and video games. I don't care how much you loved The Last Starfighter and Firefly and Rebel Galaxy, they're not real.

But you still get more from them than you do from space travel.
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Posted 6/12/17
To go to the future and find the answer to this question
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Posted 6/12/17
The purpose of time travel. I'd say money. So I can buy stuff.
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Posted 6/12/17
I'm not sure if there is a point in time traveling.

I mean, it would be very cool to see what Jesus looked like, but besides that, I feel like people would find a way to abuse the power of time travel.
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Posted 6/12/17
To complete my homework before the deadline

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Posted 6/12/17

cdarklock wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:
Not just but space the benefits are high atleast to me.


Absolutely nothing you materially benefit from has actually been to space. It was invented here and manufactured here and space travel has not one damn thing to do with it.

And all the things you think you get from space travel are not real. They are just a bullshit fantasy in your head.

When we spread out across the galaxy and colonise other planets, for example, we have absolutely no idea what will happen because first we need to address a massive series of huge problems that have no current solutions, and may never have solutions. If just one of those problems never gets a solution, we can't do it.

So spreading out and colonising planets is not reality. It is not a thing that we can do now, and it may never be a thing we can do. You can't say what it would mean, because we don't know. Nobody knows. And that is about as far from "obvious and logical" as you can get.

All of your wild speculations about how awesome it would be are just shit you made up after seeing a bunch of movies and television and video games. I don't care how much you loved The Last Starfighter and Firefly and Rebel Galaxy, they're not real.

But you still get more from them than you do from space travel.



Not from space but space research.

Also we may never do it but we don't know unless we try which is why trying is the best and most logical thing to do.

Also not it's not a speculation just expanding the race itself to another planet is awesome in itself even if every planet was/is barren and dead.

I want to see humanity try to reach for the stars and continue to research for space and use their on earth creations made for space for daily needs like they have been already.

Not trying at all would be retarded.
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Posted 6/13/17

Ryulightorb wrote:
Not from space but space research.


I do not have any objection to space research. I do not have any objection to unmanned space exploration. The Mars rover is fantastic. But putting human beings into space has never gotten us much of anything except dead astronauts and "isn't this cool?!"


Also we may never do it but we don't know unless we try which is why trying is the best and most logical thing to do.


That doesn't even make sense. Out of all the things you could do, the best and most logical one is almost certainly NOT the one least likely to succeed.


Also not it's not a speculation


Yes. Yes, it is. When you don't know the answer to something and you say "maybe..." the thing you say next is a speculation. That's what "speculation" means.


just expanding the race itself to another planet is awesome in itself even if every planet was/is barren and dead.


"It would be awesome" is not a rational justification for anything.


Not trying at all would be retarded.


No, sometimes it's actually retarded to try.

For example, you may read a lot of comic books and say "HULK COOL" and clearly you should go expose yourself to a buttload of gamma radiation, because you may never become the Hulk but you don't know unless you try so trying is the best and most logical thing to do, because getting superpowers would be awesome in itself and not trying at all would be retarded.

Except that's not what radiation does. Mostly it just kills you. And no matter how awesome you think being the Hulk is, what's retarded is when you ignore the actual science and say "BUT IT'S SO COOL."
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Posted 6/13/17

cdarklock wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:
Not from space but space research.


I do not have any objection to space research. I do not have any objection to unmanned space exploration. The Mars rover is fantastic. But putting human beings into space has never gotten us much of anything except dead astronauts and "isn't this cool?!"


Also we may never do it but we don't know unless we try which is why trying is the best and most logical thing to do.


That doesn't even make sense. Out of all the things you could do, the best and most logical one is almost certainly NOT the one least likely to succeed.


Also not it's not a speculation


Yes. Yes, it is. When you don't know the answer to something and you say "maybe..." the thing you say next is a speculation. That's what "speculation" means.


just expanding the race itself to another planet is awesome in itself even if every planet was/is barren and dead.


"It would be awesome" is not a rational justification for anything.


Not trying at all would be retarded.


No, sometimes it's actually retarded to try.

For example, you may read a lot of comic books and say "HULK COOL" and clearly you should go expose yourself to a buttload of gamma radiation, because you may never become the Hulk but you don't know unless you try so trying is the best and most logical thing to do, because getting superpowers would be awesome in itself and not trying at all would be retarded.

Except that's not what radiation does. Mostly it just kills you. And no matter how awesome you think being the Hulk is, what's retarded is when you ignore the actual science and say "BUT IT'S SO COOL."



1. ok

2. it does planning for the worst and doing what you can even if the chance of success are small if possible is logical

3. you are right my bad

4. no it's not but it would also be beneficial for growth so there is that.

5. I disagree but to each there own this is a situation where it's not retarded to try imo.
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Posted 6/13/17

Ryulightorb wrote:
it does planning for the worst and doing what you can even if the chance of success are small if possible is logical


Not if the risk-reward doesn't spec out. The risk of space travel is that we kill an astronaut about every two years, on the average.

The reward of space travel is... um... not much of anything. The Mars rover is doing more work cheaper and faster than any human being could be doing over there. That's a viable future of space exploration - for God's sake, we have landed spacecraft on asteroids now. We can get the data without losing the people. We can build smaller craft that use less fuel and can be more easily piloted. There's simply no need for people to leave Earth's orbit, and advances in robotics are making it less necessary every day.


no it's not but it would also be beneficial for growth so there is that.


Well, except for the part that we're pretty sure three years in space would sterilise you.

That's the biggest spanner in the works for humanity spreading out, you know. Well, that and the cancer. And the neural degeneration. And the vision problems. Essentially, by the time we got humanity to another planet... they'd all be sterile, dying, retarded, and blind. We don't have a solution to any of this yet, but half of it is radiation shielding and the other half is artificial gravity. The recent observation of gravitational waves takes us a lot closer to the latter, and also holds a certain promise of cheaper and better liftoff. It's that shielding problem that represents the biggest issue, really.


I disagree but to each there own this is a situation where it's not retarded to try imo.


I'd say we have tried. And it's been pretty clear that all the big dreams of spreading to other planets are just that, dreams, and they're not going to be any more than that for a really long time. Like, it's not happening within our lifetime. The closest exoplanet we could even consider for colonisation is in Proxima Centauri, and even at near-light speed that's a four-year trip one way. So you have to think about how, exactly, we are going to pack a ship with enough food, water, oxygen, and fuel to travel four years nonstop... and get it right the first time.

And then you have to consider that we've never propelled a spacecraft at more than 1/10,000 light speed. So... forty thousand years. Several times longer than all recorded history. We could potentially take that down to ten thousand years by using a gravity assist to "slingshot" the craft out of the solar system, but we can't do that with people on board because solar radiation would turn the ship into a gigantic microwave oven.

Basically, the largest and most expensive problems in the space program are all about people. We're fragile and easily broken. Once you take human beings out of the picture, space flight and exploration are largely a solved problem. Faster and better communication is where the payoff is. A drone craft that could survey Saturn and Jupiter from within the atmosphere would be a far better use of resources than sending people to Mars. Robotic retrieval of the resources on those planets makes a lot more sense than trying to send people somewhere.

I think I kind of have to call out that this has been a perfectly reasonable conversation all the way through, and that is worth its weight in gold. At no point have we devolved into name calling or incoherent ranting. That's awesome. You're awesome.
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