Post Reply I need help, ASAP. I want to remove my debit card information, and completely unsubscribe from my premium membership.
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Posted 8/31/17 , edited 9/1/17
Hello, I'm trying to completely remove my debit card information, and unsubscribe from my premium membership, but, it will not let me. It says that I must have an recurring active premium membership to view this page, even though it says that I do. I no longer use this service, and my billing date is on the fourth, and I will be charged into the negatives. I contacted support, but I am worried that they will not respond prior to four days. Is there anything that can be done without having to close my debit card?
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Posted 8/31/17 , edited 9/1/17
Contact your bank and ask them to block the recurring payment (no need to cancel the card).

A number of people have problems cancelling their subscription as the web interface is supposedly broken (I've never tried cancelling myself) and support don't always process the cancellation correctly.
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Posted 8/31/17 , edited 9/1/17
Thank you so much!
Der Zoodirektor
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Posted 9/1/17 , edited 9/1/17

MidoriNoTora wrote:

Contact your bank and ask them to block the recurring payment (no need to cancel the card).

A number of people have problems cancelling their subscription as the web interface is supposedly broken (I've never tried cancelling myself) and support don't always process the cancellation correctly.


That does not work. Banks cannot permanently block recurring payments. They can chargeback individual charges, but they cannot terminate the billing contract, as that is between the customer and the vendor. Please do not spread false information.

All banks will, without fail, forward charges resulting from recurring payment agreements to the account, and even to follow-up cards on the same account. The only way to terminate a recurring payment is contacting the vendor and having it disabled by the vendor.
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Posted 9/1/17 , edited 9/4/17

shinryou wrote:

That does not work. Banks cannot permanently block recurring payments. They can chargeback individual charges, but they cannot terminate the billing contract, as that is between the customer and the vendor. Please do not spread false information.

All banks will, without fail, forward charges resulting from recurring payment agreements to the account, and even to follow-up cards on the same account. The only way to terminate a recurring payment is contacting the vendor and having it disabled by the vendor.


As you said,

"Please do not spread false information"

In the UK customers have a legal right to ask their bank or card company to stop a recurring payment if the vendor fails to take action and then another right to reclaim payments from the bank if they continue.

I don't know whether the original poster has a similar law in their jurisdiction, which is why I advised talking to their bank.

Edit:

Doing a quick internet search there are similar protections in the USA but the process is somewhat different.


So now we have in two countries a system to achieve the impossible.
Der Zoodirektor
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Posted 9/1/17 , edited 9/1/17

MidoriNoTora wrote:

As you said,

"Please do not spread false information"

In the UK customers have a legal right to ask their bank or card company to stop a recurring payment if the vendor fails to take action and then another right to reclaim payments from the bank if they continue.

I don't know whether the original poster has a similar law in their jurisdiction, which is why I advised talking to their bank.

Edit:

Doing a quick internet search there are similar protections in the USA but the process is somewhat different.


So now we have in two countries a system to achieve the impossible.


Well, I'm dealing with customers who lost the login details for their accounts, trying to cancel payments on a daily basis. Many have tried to cancel through their bank, none have succeeded. The charges will inevitably come back, even if the bank issues chargebacks. If it were that easy to get rid of a pre-approved recurring payment, a lot more people would attempt to dodge charges, at the expense of the vendor and the bank.
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Posted 9/1/17 , edited 9/1/17
An explanation of the law in the UK:

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/banking/recurring-payments#cancel

If the bank or card company fails to cancel a recurring payment when asked they are liable to reimburse the customer so it is as if any subsequent payments never occurred (in other words, they also pay lost interest and fees caused by continuing to process the payments).


1. The system as you describe it encourages fraud by the service provider who may continue taking money until faced with court action by the customer. If the company refuses to cancel the customer is forced to keep paying until they win in court.

2. The UK system may encourage some payment dodging or other fraud by customers but the service provider then has the right to pursue court action. Also, the moment they stop receiving payment the company should automatically stop providing the service. Therefore the ability of the customer to defraud is low as the service gets cancelled while the bill is still low (unless the bank has continued to pay after the request to stop, in which case it is their own negligence they are billed for).


I prefer the UK system as the risk of fraud is small and there are several avenues for the damaged party to respond if fraud has occurred.

edit:
I would guess that people who have tried cancelling recurring payments through their banks have failed for a few reasons:

1) They are unlucky to live in a country where no similar protection exists.

2) They are ignorant of their local laws and both banks and neutral advisers tell them what they are asking for is impossible.

3) They did not follow the process set in their local laws or escalate the complaint when the bank breached their local laws.

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Posted 9/1/17 , edited 9/2/17

shinryou wrote:

If it were that easy to get rid of a pre-approved recurring payment, a lot more people would attempt to dodge charges, at the expense of the vendor and the bank.

With the exception of utilities, most recurring payments seem to be charges in advance, so I would expect the normal recourse would be to discontinue the service being paid for.
Der Zoodirektor
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Posted 9/2/17 , edited 9/2/17

TheAncientOne wrote:

With the exception of utilities, most recurring payments seem to be charges in advance, so I would expect the normal recourse would be to discontinue the service being paid for.


Yeah, you'd expect people to reach out to the vendor first, rather than trying to terminate it at the bank level. Doing it via the bank is A LOT more complicated eventually, as it leaves an open end with the vendor. Strictly speaking they still have a contract with the vendor and are liable for payment. Some vendors, especially if the items are physical, may even send debt collection services to the customer, if payments are failing or are charged back. We obviously don't do that, as we can easily terminate the service anyway in such a case.
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Posted 9/4/17 , edited 9/4/17

shinryou wrote:
If it were that easy to get rid of a pre-approved recurring payment, a lot more people would attempt to dodge charges, at the expense of the vendor and the bank.


Well, I am sorry but it is. In *europe* customers have *8 weeks* time to retroactively retract an approved payment without giving any reason. They have up to a year to retract a payment by saying there was no correct approval (and the vendor will be asked for evidence). Before this was a european legislation, it was already a bit like that in the Netherlands. A pre-approved authorised automatic imbursement was by rule not retractible, but some banks didn't care, and did it anyway. Thanks to europe you have 8 weeks time to pray that the customer is not an donkey.
And yes it is being abused. It is to protect the holy consumer that never ever does something wrong, and is always right, and deserves 10 years of warranty and support for a 1 euro investment. Some numbers exagerated.
But yes, I can retract any automatic pre-authorised payment. I cannot however retract any bank transfer or an ideal or other direct payment.
I have seen to many re-imbursements up close due to people attempting to dodge payment, and yes it is getting too easy.
Edit:
To be clear: Payments in which you authorise the vendor to take it from your bank are always retroactively retractable up to 8 weeks. These are utility, telco's, any recurring payment or single payment authorisation. (EURO INCASSO in capitals is the name).
Payments in which you transfer money to the vendor directly or indirectly (by a payment service) are not governed by that rule.
Dann0h 
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Posted 9/5/17 , edited 9/5/17
I currently on the 14 day trail and am wondering if this happens alott - If I want to opt out of premium membership I should be able to do so and not have any major problems.

Does anyone know how widespread/buggy this is?

I definitely don't want to keep paying for something that I cancelled
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