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Death Penalty Debate
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Posted 5/5/07

blacksun0918 wrote:

Guys anybody from the Philippines here? In any case you aren't a Filipino, there's a place called EDSA around here. This EDSA is where you see jaywalkers everywhere. Ignoring the traffic signs and ignoring the traffic enforcers. I came up with this idea. If I was to become a president of this country, I would put up SNIPER'S NEST on the island of the road in the middle. Everybody who jaywalks will be shot. And no case can be filed by the friends/family of the victim if the dead body would be found on the road. The victim's body wouldn't be on the road if he's not jaywalking. Believe me: WITHIN ONE WEEK, OR EVEN LESS, THERE WOULD BE NO ONE WHO WOULD DO JAYWALKING ON THE STREETS OF EDSA.

What I said may sound outrageous. But come to think of it, this would be 99.69% effective. So what's my point here? Criminals must be treated with Iron Fists. One reasons some criminals dont stop is because the authority is too gentle to them. Besides, what's the problem eliminating useless people? We're crowded here on earth. It shouldn't hurt losing one. Especially someone who might kill or do something horrible to your loved one on the future. If this person wud be kept alive, he might kill you loved ones.


Well, even now there is the death penalty, and crimes punishable by death are still commited. It might stop jaywalking, but major crimes probably won't be effected. An example would be, drug and agressive driving laws (at least in my state) have really cracked down. I still speed, and illegal drugs are more popular than ever.
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Posted 5/5/07
"Although prisons are not used this way, they are meant as places of rehibilitation. The death sentance really is much more of a punishment, and contradicts the puropse of prisons."

What's the point of rehabilitating someone who is going to spend his entire life in jail?

"I also heard about the cost of execution costing more than keeping them in prison" it costs about 60 dollars a day to house an inmate I heard. so... using some math, saying the inmate gets in jail at 25, live until 50..

25*365days*60dollars= ~$547,500 to house ONE inmate for life. Not counting the cost of detailing death.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=108#financial%20facts
I didn't have the time to read it thoroughly.. but it seems the cost details more from the bullshit legal side of it, rather then the actual execution (ie the killing) itself.

If you have ever met a criminal, you know that the system doesn't rehabilitate them, it institutionalizes them.
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Posted 5/5/07

Jorlwind wrote:

"Although prisons are not used this way, they are meant as places of rehibilitation. The death sentance really is much more of a punishment, and contradicts the puropse of prisons."

What's the point of rehabilitating someone who is going to spend his entire life in jail?

"I also heard about the cost of execution costing more than keeping them in prison" it costs about 60 dollars a day to house an inmate I heard. so... using some math, saying the inmate gets in jail at 25, live until 50..

25*365days*60dollars= ~$547,500 to house ONE inmate for life. Not counting the cost of detailing death.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=108#financial%20facts
I didn't have the time to read it thoroughly.. but it seems the cost details more from the bullshit legal side of it, rather then the actual execution (ie the killing) itself.


The point is they wouldn't spend their life in jail, they'd be rehibilitated. And don't say they could kill someone else, this is assuming the prisons fufilled their functions and they were in fact rehibilitated.

And what kind of equation did you provide? You didn't include the cost of court, lawyers, etc. Of course the inmate will have a more costly bill for a life in prison if you don't take anything that revolves around the death penalty into account. And BTW, prisoners do complete tasks to help pay for their rent. Where do you think the whole idea of stamping liscence plates came about?
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Posted 5/5/07
^ from my edit:
"f you have ever met a criminal, you know that the system doesn't rehabilitate them, it institutionalizes them."

The system doesn't work. It didn't do shit for my brother or any of his jail buddies. It hardly ever helps anyone. The only thing it seems to do is separate the lawful from the troublemakers.
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Posted 5/5/07
Did you read any of the site? Half of the titles read that the death penalty was costly and ineffective. At least have the link you used help your arguement.
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Posted 5/5/07

Jorlwind wrote:

^ from my edit:
"f you have ever met a criminal, you know that the system doesn't rehabilitate them, it institutionalizes them."

The system doesn't work. It didn't do shit for my brother or any of his jail buddies. It hardly ever helps anyone. The only thing it seems to do is separate the lawful from the troublemakers.


Um, Durr dude. I'm saying that's what the purpose of a prison is and it doesn't fufill it's purpose. We should focus on that more than the death penalty.
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Posted 5/5/07
Did you read it? The *Legal system* is costly and ineffective. The devil is in the appeals. and I atleast used a link.. which you failed to do. Here is a hyperlinked to the previous thing.
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=108#financial%20facts

*EDIT* - please don't double post..

I agree, I said that the death penalty is an imperfect solution, but so is our legal system. You can't remove the death penalty until you fix the system.
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Posted 5/5/07
Sweetie, I did use the link. Hence the evidence I used against you from the site than you scanned, not read.


I agree, I said that the death penalty is an imperfect solution, but so is our legal system. You can't remove the death penalty until you fix the system

We agree that the system is imperfect, I would just rather see a criminal in prison that unrightfuly murdering them. By killing people off you don't give them a chance to be rehibiltated. The death penalty has been abolished in many places that do not have mureders running free, or are in terrible debt.

As opposed to saying why not having it is bad, please convince me why we should have it.
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26 / M / vegass
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Posted 5/5/07
personally, i think the argument that we as people do not have the right to pass judgement on other people to justify doing away with the death penalty is weak. thats my opinion.

by the way, i love the fact that people are able to talk about something intellectual and something that affects the society, considering we are on a website to watch entertainment made to make us not worry about those things
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Posted 5/5/07

red3finition wrote:

personally, i think the argument that we as people do not have the right to pass judgement on other people to justify doing away with the death penalty is weak. thats my opinion.


I totally agree, that's the christian perspective, not all of the "Thou shall not kill" that people think it is. Who are we to judge? No one is infallible, no matter how much they think they are.
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26 / M / vegass
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Posted 5/5/07
exactly. but dont think i or anyone that believes in the death penalty are unethical or mean or evil. please.

the system isnt perfect, i can agree with that, but it hasnt failed. the issue of death penalty hasnt procured a government overthrow or any of the sort. so though it isnt perfect, i think it works. its just that there are more desperate people out there than we would like. if youve got nothing to lose, capital punishment wont really scare you. crimes in the United States are at such a high percentage because of two things: 1) the 2nd amendment's right to bear arms and 2) the amount of different cultures we have living in such a "small" place. with this many kinds of people, ideas are bound to clash. and i think the system wouldnt be so bad if there werent people to send to jail every other hour or so.

as far as WHY we should have it.. like i and many others have said, no ones come up with anything better and again, its not perfect, but it works.

opinions opinions of a typical college student...please dont smite me
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Posted 5/5/07
My internet just bombed so i'm having a problem responding.

I said the cost of death penalty details towards the legal trials, not the execution if you were listening.. The death penalty doesn't work because of moral debates like this.

"...there have been 197 capital trials in New Jersey and 60 death sentences, of which 50 were reversed."

The devil(cost) is in the legal system. The death penalty is expensive, because it's so easily appealed to the courts. Convicts have so much time on their hands to write appeals since the execution doesn't proceed soon, that the trial happens over and over again. It's far to easy to appeal in this country, there is no absolutism in verdicts. The entire system is screwed because we can't chose one or the other on moral, either one would work if you picked it and improved it.

The death penalty doesn't stop people from committing crimes because its almost never carried out. Most lawyers are good enough to weasel their client into a "prison for life" agreement, which an institutionalized criminal doesn't fear.

I'm just saying is the system has to be revamped.. you could make it work if you kept it, and you could make it work if you didn't, but something has to give.

And the judgements in trial aren't supposed to be "given out by people" as people say, their supposed to be given out by the society and its laws.

"No one is infallible, no matter how much they think they are." true, but if no one is held to account we'd have anarchy.

I'm sorry If i'm arguing too much and being rude... I don't mean to be.
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Posted 5/5/07
The only thing I can really debate is your example of the 2nd amendment. It is not wrong, but it was created in a time where people needed to defend their homes from British soldiers, fight in a militia and kill their own food. Most people don't have to worry about that now, but the amendment is still there. If it was abolished, we would be progressing. That's hot I feel about the death penalty. It was used and worked in a time where there were no other options. We need to expand our horizons and progress.

Also, I would like to state I don't find people with different opinions unethical, I simply disagree with them on the matter.

[EDIT] "I'm just saying is the system has to be revamped.. you could make it work if you kept it, and you could make it work if you didn't, but something has to give."

This is the root of our difference in opinion. On the political spectrum I am a revolutionist, and want to change the system.
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25 / M
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Posted 5/5/07
We can't progress until we fix what's broken. So thus we can't drop it until the alternative works effectively.
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25 / M
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Posted 5/5/07
We can't progress until we fix what's broken. So thus we can't drop it until the alternative works effectively.
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