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Chio's School Road Discussion

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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18

GotenLoooovesCorn wrote:

After a few episodes of crude but overly plain comedy they finally got back to the cheeky humor that feels so natural. I'll be the first to admit that Manana is now my favorite character in the series, even if Chio deserves the spotlight for her antics. Her character is so down to earth, even if all she does is yell, scold, and fight, you know she's a nice girl:

As a gif/screenshot collector I'm thoroughly satisfied so far. I just wish the soundtrack wasn't so underwhelming during those epic moments.


auroraloose wrote:
What did people think of the Momo thing? The tone didn't really fit, but I thought at least one aspect of it was impressive: No one likes a scold, and the show didn't at all mind casting Momo in a bad light. But it did give her a place to belong - and it allowed her that good thing without punishing her first, or waiting for her to improve. Chio's School Road forgives its characters for their flaws and shamelessness, and I think it can do that because it shows us that we all struggle.


This reminded me exactly of what happened in Shimoneta. Idk if you watched that one, but basically they had such a hard time with the whole "Japan frowns upon delinquent behavior" while trying to sell an edgy comedy. I've heard several times the FCC equivalent in Japan will try to get certain shows off the air or at least at a late night slot and based on certain scenes this could be one of those shows that tip toes the line. To put it in the least words possible: they're trying to add a moral compass to the show. It worked to some degree, especially for how short the skit was but it sure felt out of place. It doesn't feel like they plan on making a trio with her, and ending the show like that was very awkward. I didn't read the manga ahead of this, but I do have a hunch that something very edgy may come up later. Edgier than butt stabbing and groping I mean.


I've read the manga and the short scene with Momo at the end of this episode is certainly part of the original story and not just something added to appease the censors. Chio's School Road isn't particularly mean spirited even if the characters sometimes are and both the manga and anime have heart. I think the uneven and sudden tone shifts are the result of the stories and chapters in the source material being generally too short to fill an entire episode so we end up with an episode containing two or more chapters, often with various chapters from the source material being cut or the order rearranged to fit the time slot which can further compound the tone shift between episode segments.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18

MeltingSky wrote:

I've read the manga and the short scene with Momo at the end of this episode is certainly part of the original story and not just something added to appease the censors. Chio's School Road isn't particularly mean spirited even if the characters sometimes are and both the manga and anime have heart. I think the uneven and sudden tone shifts are the result of the stories and chapters in the source material being generally too short to fill an entire episode so we end up with an episode containing two or more chapters, often with various chapters from the source material being cut or the order rearranged to fit the time slot which can further compound the tone shift between episode segments.


Thank you as well - this is also something I wouldn't have known, though I didn't think the thing with Momo wasn't part of the manga. If there isn't much source material in the first place, it wouldn't be all that easy for the anime to pick and choose which stories to include for their potential to distract from the edgy parts.

And again, I liked the Momo thing - even annoying scolds ought to be loved.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18
I think that if you believe Momo is a "scold", you've misunderstood her character and motivations.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18
I suppose I am a bit like Chio. We both tend to ponder all the possible outcomes and ramifications of even the most mundane issues, momentarily vacillating before pushing ourselves what we consider the best outcome.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18

gornotck wrote:

I think that if you believe Momo is a "scold", you've misunderstood her character and motivations.


I think I get her character and motivations: she's interested in details, she wants things to work correctly, and she wants to help people by showing them how to conduct themselves well. She takes people's laziness personally, but she also finds such laziness unfair to everyone. There's nothing wrong with any of these things.

But being a scold is about what one does, not about one's motivations. I know how it works, because I used to be like Momo: she doesn't know how to shepherd people wisely; she only knows how to lecture to them - even if her lectures are indeed well-intentioned. And that she feels the need to do so even though she's incapable of doing so effectively, and that her need is tied to her selfish and personal wants and assessment of herself, make her wrong and naive. The thing about intentions is that they're invisible, and not necessarily correlated with the effect of the actions they might suggest to us. This isn't to say Momo's classmates are right in continuing to be unaware and uncareful, disregarding her suggestions, or disliking her. (And that teacher who shot down her idea is terrible.) If they understood what was good for them and their peers, they'd all line up, thank Momo, and ask her what they should be doing. But that's not what happens; Momo's sense of personal justice blinds her to what the people around her actually need based on where they are in life. Over on the best thing airing this season, the old guy got it right:




This is also precisely why I'm happy Chio's School Road didn't defend her behavior but also didn't come down hard on her, and gave her something good instead. She needs forgiveness as much as the lazy people around her.

So yes, Momo is a scold, even if she means well.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18
I have not caught up yet, but I can agree with the panel Auroraloose posted, even if I am unaware of the context. I would not mind if there were more cases of righteous retribution and justice being served; yet, for all the peace that can be rendered when we enforce a sense of fairness where the world would not, it is truly something magnificent when one goes beyond with a concern for others.

It is one thing to punish the criminals and scumbag, but it is far finer and rarer to attempt prevention of injustices from happening to others, to save those from your own suffering. It goes beyond fighting for justice on one's behalf or those close out of duty, to enforce a sense of fairness; but goes to keep the unfairness of the world in check.

Kindness is a choice we all can make. It isn't a reflexive reaction like maliciousness or avarice, it is not an action that reduces us to the aftermath of someone else's lack of love. Kindness is not merely reciprocating politeness with politeness, or even general respect with respect. After all, bravery is only shown in the face of true terror. To be kind is to exercise and empathetic concern in the face of the world's cruelty, out of no will other than the desire to be good to others.

To summate, being kind is to treat others how you wish yourself to be treated, a sort of one sided golden rule, rather than how they treated you. Though applied on a more global scale.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18
My thoughts on the last few episodes I watched:

+Based on personal experience, I am much like Momo in regards to friendship. I hold an idea of what the ideal friendship is like, but this more or less stymies the development of anything less than that. My desire for a bond so strong leaves me unwilling to accept anything less, and this intolerance has only grew the more I live in this isolation, admittingly. Adult life is terribly lonely. It is truthful. People with such an idealized view of friendship not only developed it in loneliness, but are lonely because of it, perhaps.

+Chio and Manana are not completely terrible individuals, and have some notable good qualities at times. The series seems to shift midway to their worse traits, so they are growing reminiscent of amoral and selfish protagonists. They are not necessarily villainous, by virtue of their lack of malice, but they are not too concerned with their impulsive acts or wanton greed. It calls back to a simpler time of adolescence it seems, where people were just developing a burgeoning sense of social conscientiousness. Instead of being conscientious on behalf of others, they are conscientious on behalf of themselves. Middle School and High School reputations obsessions. Now they just got to develop empathy, like we all did.

+For someone involved in some extraordinary incidences, Chio's attempts to maintain a below average school life rings ironic. Some men are born great, some become great, and others have greatness thrust upon them. In Chio's case, it may simply be the latter, or she may have been trying to escape her own greatness.

+Manana is that selfish asshole friend that I cannot understand why anyone would wish to be around, but it seems to be a case of vitriolic best buds who hold nothing personal, except the desire to antagonize without any long standing grudges held. For people who like to improv roleplay, as I like to call it, it can be pretty fun.

Definition of Improv-Roleplay: A sort of casual, on the spot roleplay where we either place much greater importance on a task or event, or utilize fantastical thought to alleviate boredom, improve efficiency, or just have fun.





Edit: I seriously question Kushitori's sanity as of now. The assgrabbing technique she applied to Hosokawa is so unrefined. She keep reminiscing wonderfully about Hosokawa's ass, but keep in mind that Kushitori was grabbing Hosokawa's Perineum. Not ass, Perineum. The issue here is that you don't simply grab ass by taking hold in the middle, right where the ass parts into its two sweet components. No! The female human ass was simply not meant to be contained in the palm of just one hand.

Instead, to savour such a magnificent feat of natural engineering, one must place one hand per one buttocks, and learn to appreciate the ass by the individuality of the cheeks. To appreciate the ass, one must do what they would do to the breast, and dual wield the buttocks in both hands.

This is why Kushitori isn't good at Kabaddi! She doesn't know how to grab ass correctly!




Edit: Completed the episode, she certainly improved in the ways of Kabbadi, or Grabbadi, or Grabbody, as it were. Keep both hands on the prize.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18
Here's my take on Momo: as I mentioned earlier, she unfortunately cannot understand normal social cues which makes it very hard for her to interact with other people and to figure out what they are thinking. I understand that Asperger Syndrome is no longer considered an offical diagnosis, but I suspect she has it. She takes things very literally and thus has a hard time understanding when things vary from her expectations. So, from her pespective, the fact that the class is getting poor test results is "wrong" (the whole point of school is to do as well as you can) and she thinks she will earn the gratitude of her class by coming up with a plan to improve their results. Ah, poor Momo. Genius Sensei, after reading her plan, "gets" her. What better role for a literalist than to be on the Disciplinary Committtee? There is no grey in that world. You are either in conformity with the black and white rules or you're not. Very simple. Plus, the Disciplinary Committee armband gives Momo the authority to enforce the black and white rules. She now has a sense of purpose. The role of a Displinary Committee member is by definition to be a scold since it is inevitable that some students will be in violation of the rules and regulations and it is your duty to bring them back into proper conduct. But unlike some power-hungry types who get into positions of authority so that they can get their jollies exercising power, Momo simply wants to help you become what you are supposed to be: a student who follows the rules.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18
Asperger syndrome is considered outdated and overused as a term, and is something many have proposed to fit under the general label of Autism Spectrum Disorder. While there is significant traction to have more stringent criteria for Autism, so as to disallow people are just "different", ala neurodiversity, it is still an official diagnosis; just perhaps not by that term. I could be wrong.

I am coming up on this episode, but the discussion is getting the brain blood going.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18

auroraloose wrote:
What did people think of the Momo thing? The tone didn't really fit, but I thought at least one aspect of it was impressive: No one likes a scold, and the show didn't at all mind casting Momo in a bad light. But it did give her a place to belong - and it allowed her that good thing without punishing her first, or waiting for her to improve. Chio's School Road forgives its characters for their flaws and shamelessness, and I think it can do that because it shows us that we all struggle.



I liked this episode quite a bit.

As stated before, Momo may have good intentions, but her methodology is somewhat flawed, partly because she does not understand people too well. She is unable to comprehend why they would not want to improve their test scores, or why other's behaviors or words may not correlate with their actual desires.

I say may, as Momo being a scold is open to interpretation. We can safely say she is devoid of malice, but her emotional outburst may simply arise out of being unable to connect with others effectively, and the pain of an unchosen solitude, rather than of concern for others. It may be a mixture of both. She may have not thought of why the rules are in place, except of the general assumption that they ought to be followed for future contentment overall.

As stated before, Momo does not appear to have any close friends, yet she holds an extremely idealistic idea on what friendship should be, rather than what most around her would consider it to be. Sadly, the type of friendship Momo wants is usually reserved in shounen manga; most other individuals desire something more casual.

This plays well in into the previous vignette with Chio and Manana, where Manana jumped an urban gorge without hesitation to scold Chio, who was worried considering her dangerous stunt. Chio, in turn, was worried that Manana would be seriously injured if she failed the jump. For all the petty bickering and underhanded schemes they engage in, Chio and Manana obviously care for one another. Which also hearkens back to Momo's debut episode, where she expressed confusion at how Chio and Manana's behavior contradicted her notion of what friendship should be, despite their friendship embodying the core essentials of what Momo desires.

Momo may not have come out of the incident with Chio and Manana with a clearer idea of what friendship of that level entails, but with things to ponder and reconsider.

Momo seems too inept at understanding social nuances and general rules of thumbs, so she may be seeking rules and guidelines etched in ink and chalk in order to have some semblance of understanding others. It can be a sort of fallback for many like minded individuals.

Regarding the idea of a scold, I agree wholeheartedly with this line of yours.


This is also precisely why I'm happy Chio's School Road didn't defend her behavior but also didn't come down hard on her, and gave her something good instead. She needs forgiveness as much as the lazy people around her.


People often don't want to be told they are right, deep down; they just want to be understood. To see Gotou sensei take the initiative to understand her point of view, while offering constructive criticism exemplifies the optimal approach. People aren't monsters, robots, freaks, or goody two shoes, or at least most of them. We all obey a rationale that propels our actions at any time. If we do something wrong, we don't want to be vindicated of it, but understood that as human beings, we make errors.

Which to go onto another notion, Momo has a crush on Gotou sensei where she wishes to get closer to him. I think that knowing her backstory this puts her character into an incredibly sweet light. She could easily be the Anzu of Chio's School Road.

I am unsure if Momo has selfless concern for others, or is exactly abiding by a sense of justice. She may be a scold, but her reasoning may differ. She may just be lonely and socially inept, and abide by rules because they are the only ones clearly stated. This is especially apparent given that she took Manana's advice and attempted to fight off a rival.

My conclusion? She has many reasons, and likely it is both altruism with loneliness.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/27/18

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

I say may, as Momo being a scold is open to interpretation. We can safely say she is devoid of malice, but her emotional outburst may simply a
I am unsure if Momo has selfless concern for others, or is exactly abiding by a sense of justice. She may be a scold, but her reasoning may differ. She may just be lonely and socially inept, and abide by rules because they are the only ones clearly stated.


It seems to me that the show was trying to show us that Momo thought that people would like her if she came up with ways to help them study. I don't think it is so much that she is disappointed in her peers, it is that she doesn't understand how to make friends and deal with people her own age. This was first shown when she mistook Chio and Manana's antic as adversarial rather than friendly. She actually thought people would like her if she tried to help them be better in school. She didn't understand that it just made everyone think she was a suck up or teacher's pet.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/27/18
I'll tell you the deal with Momo. Some kids grow up believing what they are told by their parents and teachers, be good, help others, follow, the rules, always tell the truth, and trying their hardest to do what they are told. They also tend to believe everyone else thinks the same way they do, except for the obvious "bad" people. She also assumes people will appreciate her help and sharing her knowledge, things she is doing completely altruistically, not for praise or ego. Of course by high school this is when they finally realize not everyone else thinks the way they do as most kids by high school start getting annoyed by the one student who still thinks like a kid and listens to the adults. This usually gets them labeled a teacher's pet, brown noser, or on this show goody two shoes. This of course leads to the goody two shoes having to deal with the revelation everyone doesn't think the way they do or appreciate their "help", and when even teacher's get annoyed it's even harder to deal with because they are the very authority figures who instilled those values in them. Luckily Momo has that one teacher who does understand she's just a good kid who is just sincerely trying to help everyone else, and not some annoying know it all looking fo stoke their ego, or a holier-than-thou busy body pointing out other people's flaws.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/26/18

HOOfan_1 wrote:


PeripheralVisionary wrote:

I say may, as Momo being a scold is open to interpretation. We can safely say she is devoid of malice, but her emotional outburst may simply a
I am unsure if Momo has selfless concern for others, or is exactly abiding by a sense of justice. She may be a scold, but her reasoning may differ. She may just be lonely and socially inept, and abide by rules because they are the only ones clearly stated.


It seems to me that the show was trying to show us that Momo thought that people would like her if she came up with ways to help them study. I don't think it is so much that she is disappointed in her peers, it is that she doesn't understand how to make friends and deal with people her own age. This was first shown when she mistook Chio and Manana's antic as adversarial rather than friendly. She actually thought people would like her if she tried to help them be better in school. She didn't understand that it just made everyone think she was a suck up or teacher's pet.


I understand how that is, which is perhaps why my interpretation differs in that regards others. An individual is interesting, but people are mysterious and arbitrarily contrived, as I use to say. Lonely individuals may tsun between the sour grapes and revel in their supposed superiority, in order to stave off a bout of deep depression with a double dose of inferiority.

Tomoko Kuroki of Watamote is the quintessential example of how an adolescence deals with social isolation.

Momo isn't like that, however. So far, she is portrayed as wanting to be close to someone, and has never lost sight of that. She has done nothing but "helped" people not only in accordance of the rules, but what she thinks they would want. The issue here is that she does not understand them. She hasn't shunned society to give her the comforting illusion of choice (Sour Grapes), she hasn't resorted simply dehumanizing them as less than individuals to mere pathologies to be kowtowed and led for some greater good (Sour Grapes and Superiority Inferiority complex).

So yes, that is what I am thinking of now. A lack of malice doesn't necessarily make her so selflessly caring, but that is up in the air. It seems we agree overall. In any case, I am less confident in her holding a sacrosanct exaltation of the rules, rather than lacking in a fortunately altruistic spirit.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/27/18

kkmenchi wrote:

I'll tell you the deal with Momo. Some kids grow up believing what they are told by their parents and teachers, be good, help others, follow, the rules, always tell the truth, and trying their hardest to do what they are told. They also tend to believe everyone else thinks the same way they do, except for the obvious "bad" people. She also assumes people will appreciate her help and sharing her knowledge, things she is doing completely altruistically, not for praise or ego. Of course by high school this is when they finally realize not everyone else thinks the way they do as most kids by high school start getting annoyed by the one student who still thinks like a kid and listens to the adults. This usually gets them labeled a teacher's pet, brown noser, or on this show goody two shoes. This of course leads to the goody two shoes having to deal with the revelation everyone doesn't think the way they do or appreciate their "help", and when even teacher's get annoyed it's even harder to deal with because they are the very authority figures who instilled those values in them. Luckily Momo has that one teacher who does understand she's just a good kid who is just sincerely trying to help everyone else, and not some annoying know it all looking fo stoke their ego, or a holier-than-thou busy body pointing out other people's flaws.


Seems for Momo, she hasn't caught on to this yet.

The main contention here is that we have little idea as to how Momo would go about categorizing another as a "bad" person. While one can assign acts to being black or white, this doesn't necessarily translate to deeming individuals by such encompassing labels.

This may be gleaned from her actions towards Chio and Manana. She simply ordered them to separate, without rendering a moral judgement on them as people.

Given her later action of keeping her promise in lieu of abiding the rules, it seems she has grown to be more lenient, either due to understanding people better or not holding a sincere reverence in the first place.

That being said, I may be wrong. It seems Momo wouldn't be required to type up a study plan, but she did so anyway. This seemd to point to the belief that before, Momo doesn't understand why people wouldn't want higher grades.

This is an altruistic act, seemingly driven by more than a reverence of rules, and beyond just expectations.
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Posted 8/26/18 , edited 8/27/18

PeripheralVisionary wrote:


kkmenchi wrote:

I'll tell you the deal with Momo. Some kids grow up believing what they are told by their parents and teachers, be good, help others, follow, the rules, always tell the truth, and trying their hardest to do what they are told. They also tend to believe everyone else thinks the same way they do, except for the obvious "bad" people. She also assumes people will appreciate her help and sharing her knowledge, things she is doing completely altruistically, not for praise or ego. Of course by high school this is when they finally realize not everyone else thinks the way they do as most kids by high school start getting annoyed by the one student who still thinks like a kid and listens to the adults. This usually gets them labeled a teacher's pet, brown noser, or on this show goody two shoes. This of course leads to the goody two shoes having to deal with the revelation everyone doesn't think the way they do or appreciate their "help", and when even teacher's get annoyed it's even harder to deal with because they are the very authority figures who instilled those values in them. Luckily Momo has that one teacher who does understand she's just a good kid who is just sincerely trying to help everyone else, and not some annoying know it all looking fo stoke their ego, or a holier-than-thou busy body pointing out other people's flaws.


Seems for Momo, she hasn't caught on to this yet.

The main contention here is that we have little idea as to how Momo would go about categorizing another as a "bad" person. While one can assign acts to being black or white, this doesn't necessarily translate to deeming individuals by such encompassing labels.
.


Huh we clearly see when she did the "why just me" losing it scene she has caught on. And when I said 'obvious bad people' we all remember the "bad" kids who were always purposely getting in trouble and getting sent to the principal. For someone like Momo besides these obvious rule breakers she would just assume everyone else is like her, which is why she tells people she sees breaking the rules what they are doing wrong. They must just be uninformed, not bad people.
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